Listening to Jon speak is a little like being with
a kid who just got the coolest toy in the world and can’t wait to
tell you all about it. There
is an unabashed enthusiasm in his voice, a sincerity that flows
faster than a river at high tide and a contagious passion that can
make you wish you loved your job as much as he loves his.
You are welcome to eavesdrop in our recent conversation
where we discussed a variety of things.
RP – Thanks for taking time to speak with us.
We just wanted to talk a little about your new company and
the upcoming show, and maybe some background material, if it’s OK.
JC – Sure, where would you
like to start?
RP – Well, I read something about you sort of
playing the guitar when you were in college?
That kind of intrigued me a little bit – would you like to
talk about that?
JC - (laughing) Well, let me
start by saying that I had done theatre in high school and had
always kind of been interested in it, but I didn’t actually
believe that I was actually “good enough” (his quotes) to do it
for real or that there was a real career to be had there, except for
people who were really good at it, so I never really entertained
that as a serious option.
RP – Did you go right into theatre in college?
JC – I had taken a year
off between high school and college, because I continued to be
undecided about my major. I
knew I wasn’t ready for college then so in that one year off I
started working in a bar and the experience of that bar convinced me
that I had to go back to school and see what other options are out
there for me.
RP – So where did you decide to continue school?
JC – I went to a small
liberal arts college in Virginia and was still undecided about my major at first. I didn’t want to
get sucked into the theatre scene.
But I joined a small ensemble that comprised the entire
theatre program at the school. They
were really great people and the professor that would eventually
become my mentor was a real hard ass.
He was really into discipline and into focus and it wasn’t
about being pretentious – it wasn’t about self.
It was about a group of people working together.
This kind of work ethic really inspired me and invigorated me
and soon I found myself drifting over in the dark side and finally
declared my major in
theatre.
RP – So where does the guitar fit in all this?
JC – We had several
student directed one-acts and one of my buddies directed a play
called Alky which is about
people driving drunk and how you can get into an accident – it was
a heavily messaged play and I played this sort of narrator-like
character and some of my classmates thought it would be sort of cool
if I had a guitar – maybe it could add something to the piece.
RP – You play guitar?
JC – I told them – “I
don’t play guitar”, but they said “Oh it doesn’t matter.
You can just hold it like a prop.”
RP – So you were just holding the guitar?
JC – Well, it didn’t
seem right just holding it, so I tried plucking a couple of strings
and made it look like I was actually doing something
and that I really knew what to do with this six stringed
thing sitting on my lap.
RP – How did it sound?
JC – I wasn’t satisfied
with the noises coming out of the guitar, so I began to conceal the
string noises by singing over them.
RP – Have you had vocal training?
JC – I never had any vocal
training either. However,
I managed to put something together and Kevin (the director) added
lyrics, and I guess I was pretty convincing that I knew what I was
doing. Then my professor
saw me playing this and by then I had joined a traveling performance
troupe playing folklore music called that Jack Tale Players.
They would take the oral tradition of the Blue Ridge mountains
and tell the stories and folk tales all centering around the
character of Jack. They had been handed down generation after
generation and a man named Richard Chase collected them into a book.
That’s when my mentor scripted them out improvisationally
based and staged them for kids.
Then there was also a musical component, and Rex had been
looking for a guitarist for this group.
He had seen me in Alky and asked me to join the troupe
playing the guitar. I
told him I didn’t play but he said “I saw you playing before –
“ and I tried to convince him that I was just doing a little
plucking – “ but he
would not accept my protest. I
kept trying to convince him that I was not a player, but he would
not go for it and so I was so committed to being in this group that
I forced myself to learn to play guitar so he wouldn’t think I was
on an ego trip.
RP – How that self learning go?
JC – I was pretty dreadful
for awhile, but eventually I learned enough chords to be able to
play some of the cheat sheets of Blue Ridge Mountain songs.
Later on I started playing with people who knew how to play
so I kind of learned from them.
Then through the course of school doing other productions of
known playwrights and some productions my professor wrote that were
Civil War themed, there was always the opportunity to play guitar
for some Civil War songs. I
was given the chance to compose some original pieces, just for
guitar so by the time I had graduated college, without learning how
read a note of music I actually became a published composer because
he got a couple of his plays published.
RP – Did someone else write the music for you?
As you strummed the guitar someone was writing it down?
JC – Yes.
When he published it he worked with somebody else through
recordings and they actually transcribed it on music paper so they
could submit it to the publisher.
When we were first learning the song, though it was learning
by ear. We would hear it
several times, which is the way I had learned to play, it was sort
of collaborative then. The
song wouldn’t always end up the way I had heard it in my dorm
room, but the collaboration added a lot to it because I had the
chance to work with some pretty talented singers who made it sound
good.
RP – That’s amazing!
JC – Well, you’d have to
listen to the music before you use a word like amazing, but I think
it was all right. Personally,
for me it represented a lot more in terms of growth and building
confidence and attitude, believing that if you can’t do something,
you can always figure out a way to learn how to do it.
RP – How long were you with the Jack Tale
players?
JC – At the time they were
one of longest playing children’s theatre group in the state and I
was with them for about six seasons, and they’ve been traveling
for about 20 years. One
of the cool things about them was that the theatre really did evolve
from the Blue Ridge mountain oral tradition in that part of Southern
Virginia. I mentioned
Richard Chase earlier – he would go talk to these families up in
the mountains, because that’s how the news was told, by telling
stories. He actually
captured all these stories and put them in a book and my professor
brought Chase to the school where he talked to the students about
these stories and the professor scripted them.
Even though there are scripts for the Jack Tale players, it
was watching other people do them and pass them down that made it
more improvisational and experiential.
The style in which you learn the story to act it out was
indicative of the way it had been told from generation to
generation. It was very
stripped down – very few props and some sound effects, but it was
mostly the characterizations of these people that were told in a way
that the young people seeing them found meaning. When you play to
teens if they don’t like something they make no pretense about
letting you know, and these stories kept them very captivated.
I learned an important lesson then that it wasn’t the big
flashy things that grabbed them – but rather the substance that
held their interest.
RP – All this preceded the film Death of A
Nation in which you play the lead?
JC – Yes, it did.
RP – How did you go from the Blue Ridge
Mountains to Death of A Nation, which is somewhat controversial and
hard hitting?
JC – Ah – (laughing) By
way of a couple of national tours doing Shakespeare and I landed
back in Washington D.C. where
I was born and raised just outside the district.
So after college and Jack Tales I did a couple of tours with
the National Players which is a long running classical touring
company that would do two shows in rep for nine months.
It was always one Shakespeare piece and one non-Shakespeare
play. For my first tour
I did Taming of the Shrew and of Mice and Men.
RP – What role did you have in Mice and Men?
JC – I was Slim.
In college I played George, and in the Shrew I played
Lucentio – then our Petruccio left the tour and I picked up that
role for the rest of the tour. There
were other plays and that was an interesting experience traveling
all over the country for nine months with twelve other people.
Not only that, we were also responsible for all the technical
work so in addition to all the roles we played, we were the workers.
For example I was the master electrician so before a show I had to
lug in all the lights, aim them, focus them make sure they all
worked and the electricity was running through our system and then
go change into my costume and play Orsino in Twelfth Night.
That was something I picked up in college from my professor.
He didn’t let us get away with just being performers – he
felt it was very important to contribute in all aspects of
production. There was
also a part of the program with the National Players to have
educational theatre – drama at the core of the curriculum.
So this continued my trajectory of trying to be well rounded
and apply things that I had learned or have an open and willing
attitude to learn all sides of the coin.
So after the tour I ended up
in Washington D.C. and did a lot of theatre there and soon I got
called in to audition for this film Death of a Nation.
RP – This was a local production filming in DC?
JC – It was a local
American University grad who was shooting it with an L.A. crew and
when you’re in DC this is a tremendously important thing.
He was shooting on 35 mm where most people might use digital
so this was a big deal. So
after many callbacks he finally decided to cast me as the lead in
the film.
RP - When you were acting on the film did you have
any input into the story line or the script or were you just reading
the lines they gave you?
JC – The director, Mike,
was a pretty young guy when he first got the script and the way he
approached making the film was very technical. His focus first was
camera angles, sets, props, scenery and he just sort of put words on
a page and hadn’t given serious thought to the casting or the
acting. When he started
putting up the money to do the film he got a bunch of buddies and
assumed that since he wrote the words we would take care of
everything else with lighting or film and he felt the acting was
sort of secondary or tertiary. When
the producer told him he better cast the thing, he went through this
long, long audition process and started seeing professional actors
who brought a lot of different things to the table and sort of
realized that maybe actors were worth more than he ever thought.
So we started rehearsing and
doing read throughs and Mike would come to me and ask me what I
thought about a scene. So
I would tell him things like, “this might work like this” or
“coming from a character perspective – blah blah “.
RP – And he accepted your input?
JC – He actually became
more and more open to the ideas.
I certainly would never presume to change anyone’s script
but once he said he welcomed feedback we went through some
discussions and a few re-writes of the script.
The film actually shot for years – years!
We would shoot huge chunks of it and then go away and he
would go to try to work some things on post, so we would do some
re-shoots and we’d go back. It
was so long that the technology had changed to the point that
sometimes they had problems matching film stock.
I would often tease Mike and tell him if the shooting goes
longer I’ll be able to play my own father!
But over the course of time we formed a friendship and a bond
where he trusted me in terms of the acting and trusted my feedback
and ideas. In fact, we
spoke recently and he was talking about a new film project and
perhaps Mutineer can be involved.
RP – Is that Michael Pollok?–
JC – Yes I’m not sure
how they finally credited him on IMDB.
RP – Now let me ask you about Mutineer Theatre
– did you chose that name yourself?
JC – Yes I did.
RP – Mutineer sounds to me like kind of someone
who is challenging - - - perhaps even a little degenerate? What was
your intent?
JC – I think there is a
variety of reasons why that name came about.
I think the one that is the most fun for me comes from my
experiences in Washington DC and being very close the New York
theatre scene and experiencing theatre in one way, when I moved to
L.A. about five years ago I was pretty burned out.
I had to be very creative on how to pay my bills, because
even being an Equity actor in DC, working in some of the more
prominent theatres it was still hard to pay the bills.
At one point I felt that I was just punching a clock and
wasn’t working for the creative reasons but rather just to
survive. So I came to
L.A. just for a change of scenery because I believe it has a lot to
offer in terms of diversity, landscape, weather.
Then there’s Hollywood and the fun and craziness it has and
the national parks, but probably the diversity is one of the
strongest reasons I’m drawn to L.A.
RP – And you began your theatre experience in
L.A.?
JC – Well, I was kind of
hanging out, getting the lay of the land so to speak, and in my
experiences with theatre I was sort of told that “This is the way
you’re supposed to do it. You
have to do it like this or like that” and I thought to myself,
“I never had people tell me how you were supposed to do things so
much back east”. Out
here people kept telling me that this is how it’s supposed to be
done here and I’ve always had a tough time with the concept of art
having rules. I hear
things like we should do this piece this way and let’s tell the
story the exact way we told the other story.
To me that’s pretty contradictory to art, so that’s why
the Mutineer has a lot of rebellion.
It’s as if in the past the concept was that you were on
this boat and the captain is guiding the boat and there’s a larger
power structure telling you where you should go and how what your
course should be. The
concept of Mutineer is that were on t his boat and lets see what
other course we can take. We
know we can go in the waters that have been traveled by everyone –
but what happens if we decide to go in waters that are uncharted?
What kind of winds might we find?
I’m not looking to become
a pirate or anything but just the idea of experimenting is exciting.
Even if there’s a chance that we should fail, I think we
can learn more from than endeavor that you would doing it the way
people tell you it should be done to succeed.
That works creatively but the challenge is when you have
funds in trust and you’re working for a non-profit and they trust
you to do the right thing. I
think that failing creatively or being challenged creatively is
different than taking risks with the organization, and that’s not
something I would do because there’s people that have invested
enough and I need to be respectful of and appreciate what they’ve
done..
RP – How did you select “Lie with Me” as
your first production for Mutineer?
JC – A little over a year
ago Mutineer was an idea then, but I hadn’t put together a company
yet. Basically, I threw
up a logo on the web and asked for submissions so I could start
going through stuff that was already out there.
I wasn’t exactly blown away by what I received, and that
was partly my fault, because I hadn’t tapped into some of the
outlets where good original works originate.
It was more for networking and seeing what was out there.
So I had a conversation with
Keith (Bridges) a year ago and he knew that I was sort of frustrated
because I couldn’t find the right material.
So he made an offer where I would commission him and we would
work together. I agreed
and in a few months he sent me a couple of treatments and I put
together a group of people. Keith flew in to L.A. and we sat at the
lobby of the Open Fist Theatre and we talked it out.
He had three ideas, all of them very challenging and
different and each posed it’s own set of obstacles in terms of
development, in terms of story and in terms of production.
But, we all sort of gravitated to the most emotionally and
intellectually challenging idea. I was really impressed by the fact
that people did not shy away from the challenge.
They represented a wide range of experiences – many were
professional theatre people, bringing a great deal of intellect so
it was great to see this group of people get together and be
unanimous in their choice.
Se we started to develop it
and from the very beginning everyone was participatory in terms of
the ideas and the story structure, and for us the underlying theme
was asking the question – “What if?”
RP – What if?
JC – What if. . . I think
that’s one of the fundamental questions a creative writer can ask.
What if? And so this
play experiences that question.
What if a man falls in love with a woman who happens to be
his daughter? What is
the collateral effect and consequences on the people immediately
around them? We talked
about one of the lines in the play where a character accuses another
character about always lying and then because of the sleeping around
and the dishonesty one of the company members came up with the idea
of “Lie with Me” and there’s a sexual connotation to that and
also a dishonest connotation.
RP – In fact, when I got the press release from
Judith Borne I wrote back to ask if the meaning of the title was to
sleep together or to tell lies together – and she said “yes!”
JC – Exactly
RP – You’re opening at the Art/Works Theatre
and I was wondering why you picked that venue. Is there something
you like about it or is it because it was the only one available for
those dates?
JC- (laughing)
You know, it was a little of both.
First let me say that the play was born about the same time
that Mutineer was born, and both entities have been developing at
the same time. It was really important to me to put together more
than a play. I’m
hoping to put together an organization and perhaps someday an
institution that does focus on developing original work.
Not knowing a lot of the ins-and-outs of L.A. Theatre
production and wanting to do the piece justice, because it’s our
first and I feel it’s vital to make a difference, both creatively,
financially and otherwise -
and after talking to many experts in that area, all that led me to
Racquel Lehrman of Theatre Planners.
RP – Oh yes – we know Racquel
JC – Racquel gave me a
checklist and said, “You can produce –“ but I think because
there’s so much going on creatively in the organization, it’s
been great that I can focus on that an Racquel handling the
production aspect and even though Mutineer is the exec producer of
the show, Racquel has been doing most of the production work.
Racquel has a lot of connections and we looked at a lot of
places. Our goal was to be cost effective, but we also didn’t want
to cut corners and so I think Art/Works brings the best of all
worlds for us. It’s a
good stage and we wanted 99 seats or less, since I’m a member of
actors Equity and we wanted to respect the union system by staying
under 99 seats. And
starting out in the worst economic climate in years we wanted to
make be mindful of that and not shoot myself in the foot before we
even began. Art/Works is
a good space creatively and financially for us.
RP – Well, I can personally tell you that you
have one of the best teams in town on your side.
I’ve known Racquel since 2002 and I met Judith Borne
shortly after and with those two working with you, you are getting
the very best.
JC – I appreciate hearing
that.
RP – Let me ask you this, if I may.
Let us suppose that someone who never goes to the theatre
comes in to see your play, out of curiosity or because a friend
brought them. This is a non-theatre person, perhaps the kind you
might want to reach. What
would you like them to take away from your play after seeing it?
JC – (long pause) The need
– or the desire to go again. I
think if people have a theatre experience that they recognize as
relevant to their life and it inspires them to go see something
else, and not necessarily our theatre or our show, but just to go to
the theatre again, then I feel like we’ve done our job.
RP – Now Jon, you’re a creative person – a
thinker, if you will.
Think about this.
Let me take forward in time – about 30 years or so and
there is an awards show for theatre and your name is mentioned as
the recipient of the Lifetime Achievement Award. What
might that achievement be?
JC – Hmmm – wow.
You know, I have to say, you threw me off at Lifetime
Achievement Award. If it
could the that there was a Los Angeles theatre community and
Mutineer could be a part of it that would be outstanding, but this
LA theatre community would grow into a far more collaborative
community and more of a sharing of resources, in terms of pooled
auditions and group auditions and resources in terms of casting and
in terms of promotion and incorporating new media into that and it
really, really was one solid big Los Angeles theatre community where
we were maximizing the shared resources and Mutineers could be a
part of that, I believe that would be quite an accomplishment.
RC – And you would be the one to help bring this
about?
JC – I certainly don’t
think that I could take credit for all that, but I would love to be
a part of that. There’s
a list on the Yahoo groups where several people list what they need
– like we’re looking for a couch or we have auditions – or
I’m an acting coach - that kind of thing where people share
services.
Then there’s also a lot of
people that talk a lot. Sometimes
there’s a huge disconnect between things that are brought up or
proposed and things that are really actualized and follow through
becomes difficult. It
think it would be cool if we were a community that supported one
another to help each other around the bend.
RC – Well, it’s been great talking to you.
We’ve talked about you and about your show.
Is there anything that you would like to add that we may not
have covered?
JC – I just want to add we
hope Mutineer is a company that will be around, we’re interested
in non-traditional collaborations and I definitely would like to
help develop original works and work with different companies in
this town. I know that
there are already some partnerships and collaborations efforts out
there, and I’m not saying that it doesn’t happen, but in the
future it would be great to see that become more evident.
We chatted a little about other theatres, mainly
the Pasadena Playhouse and it’s unbelievable advance ticket sales
announcement of over $300,000 for Stormy Weather starring Leslie
Uggams, and Jon spoke about his involvement with radio station KPCC
89.3 FM, an affiliate of NPR.
As
has been the case with every one of the persons we have interviewed,
Jon is gifted with that extra element that separates the shakers and
movers from the moved and shaken. Some call it passion, others
will say it's a fire in the belly. Whatever it is, here is a
person who is not content with the everyday status quo and who is
willing to take a risk to bring about some kind of change or make
some kind of difference. It's evident that Jon's commitment is
for a lifetime and with that it will be fascinating to follow his
course as he sails the often stormy waters in search of his new
world. Our wish for him is simple. May the winds be on
his back in every journey he partakes.
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